"Pick an instrument" day

[AtomicClock]

At the beginning of fifth grade, the local music store hosted an evening session at school where we children were invited to try the different band instruments, and pick one. I assume this is a common occurrence.

In my case, the facilitator took one look at my face, declared it was suitable for either trombone or saxophone, and so I tried those two. Since then, I've always wondered whether that one look was real, or if he really considered other things, like what players the HS band director needed or how much of a commission he thought he could wring out of my parents.

How much can really be learned from looking at an 11 year-old's lips? I'm guessing not much.

[BGuttman]

When I was in 4th grade they gave us a pitch and rhythm test. Those of us who did well were put in the 5th grade music program.

First day of 5th grade we were asked what we wanted to play. You could choose brass or woodwind (or percussion, but that's another kettle of fish). I asked for brass. They looked at my relatively tall body and put me on trombone. I think I also did well in the pitch test. Was it a quick look? No. The quick look was "can he reach 6th position". Nothing to do with saxophone.

[ghmerrill]

The quick look was "can he reach 6th position". Nothing to do with saxophone.

For me this happened at the end of the 5th grade. In NY State we had participated in what at the time was a kind of national movement to teach instrumental music to students beginning in (I think) 4th (possibly 3rd?) grade. We had regularly scheduled class sessions (led by the classroom teacher) in which we learned to read and play music using "Tonettes" -- which were essentially plastic recorders (not quite, but close). It was very successful. By the end of 5th grade I could read and play treble clef with some facility on the Tonette -- and enjoyed it immensely.

At the end of the 5th grade year we each met with the 6th grade music teacher to determine what instrument would be best for us. In my case, the teacher was a violin-playing martinet resembling Napoleon in both stature and attitude. I wanted very much to play trombone (as my mother had). He insisted that I couldn't reach 6th position and could therefore not play trombone. I ended up with saxophone -- which I doggedly persisted in for about 15 years. Ironically, I was one of the taller longer-armed students in my grade and definitely could reach 6th position. So ...?

Approximately 35 years later, I bought a bass trombone.

[BGuttman]

In 4th grade we learned FlutoPhone - a rather brash version of the recorder (also plastic).

Band started in 5th grade. I started trombone and promptly forgot all the treble clef I learned in 4th grade.

[AtomicClock]

Also, I suspect it was these evaluations that segregated the girls to the woodwinds (flute/clarinet) and the boys to brass (trombone/trumpet). For some reason, the saxophones always had a good mix. They were discouraging "exotic" instruments like horn and drums entirely.

[ghmerrill]

Girls got to play French horn more than boys.

[MrHCinDE]

At my school, about 7-8 years old, the whole year group got to listen to demonstrations by the peripatetic teachers on a couple of each instrument family. The trombone was loud, slightly obnoxious, could make silly noises and just sounded the most fun. As a 7 year old boy who loved creating chaos it was my choice, I‘m not going to try and claim it was anything to do with its musical potential. At the end of the demos there was a chance to go and try out any instruments and figure it out from there. It was pretty clear my arms were too short and the school trombones were all broken or taken so I started on baritone/euphonium instead, with the plan to move to trombone later, which I eventually did about 10 years later.

[heldenbone]

I got kicked out of flutophone class for lack of skill or discipline. Fast forward to a MM performance and doubling trumpet and bass trombone. Those seers of our musical aptitude aren't always right.

[BGuttman]

There's no way to play a flutophone delicately. I wonder how our teachers survived.

[ghmerrill]

Those seers of our musical aptitude aren't always right.

They were seemingly right about your future as a woodwind player -- and probably identified you immediately as a natural low brass or percussion player.

[calcbone]

I actually picked trumpet the first time, and then went with trombone when I (mercifully ) got a second chance.

I went to a very small private school until I was 9. I had skipped 2nd grade, so I had just turned 9 halfway through 4th grade, when all of us started on band instruments—this was January 1992 (yes, all of us—like I said, small school…there were 7 of us in the 4th grade class). We had spent the last month or two of the fall semester on recorders or something similar. Then, the music teacher brought in some instruments for us to try, and I ended up choosing the trumpet. I borrowed one from her/the school I guess. It was silver, and it had some kind of faux leather gig bag-that’s all I remember about it!

The next school year, I started going to the local public school. They started the band program in 5th grade. We were given a music aptitude test like the one Bruce described above, and those of us who did well enough were put in a class to learn recorder (again, for me anyway) and prepare to start on a band instrument. The high school band director came over at the end of the day to teach us.

So a few months into the year, we “graduated” and selected our instruments. This time, they had people come in to guide us and a larger selection of instruments. I decided to go into it with an open mind and try out trumpet, trombone, and clarinet. I could make a sound OK on all of them, but the guy seemed to be impressed most with my sound on trombone, and the fact that I was able to play (I guess) low B-flat and F in first position without much problem.

I went with his advice (never mind the fact that I was still only 9 and could barely reach 6th, and could not reach the mouthpiece receiver with my index finger!) and never looked back… 31 years later

[hyperbolica]

I started on the flutophone as well. Obnoxious little thing, but I saw it as my gateway to a real instrument. After completing the flutophone course, I was given the opportunity to select a real instrument. So I said "slide trombone or snare drum". My parents rented me a King 605. I was fascinated by the blue velvet and the smell of the case.

[ghmerrill]

My parents rented me an old Buescher alto sax. The case had a fascinating smell as well, but maybe not so much like yours.

[Kjong3545]

I helped out with this in high school, so I have a loose idea of the process (I was more of an assistant to the director and college students doing most of the actual advising)

Few things you check for (outside of student interest) was lip size and shape (firmer lips are more suitable for trumpet playing, a lack thereof can make developing a wide range more difficult), trombone of course was a check for arm length and whether they were able to reach 5th or 6th position (ironically, I still can't reach 7th. Any other 5'1 trombone players here?)

Flute and Clarinet were chosen for those with smaller, skinnier fingers, especially keeping the future for Eb and Piccolo in mind (this causes the gender variation we all know). (Brass being favored by males is more often a student preference thing). Flute of course is also just a matter of the student making a sound, as the instrument with the largest beginner difficulty curve it's useful to give students advantages where they can.

I still can't play a saxophone and have tried to make sounds multiple times so I couldn't tell you much about that but it's really just everyone else, which is why beginner bands always have too many.

[KWL]

When I was five or six, we attended a band concert at our local park. A trombone player was featured and his playing was just fabulous, at least to my young ears. Fifth grade rolled around and I got to pick trombone as my instrument. No testing, no decision by anyone other than me. Think about what life altering effect a performer can have, even during some mundane outdoor union trust fund gig.

And yes, my arms were not long enough. The band director showed me how to tie a string around my finger and the slide brace so I could throw the slide to seventh and yank it back. I’m sure I had an elegant legato style.

[cmcslide]

I remember in the fourth grade being handed a slip of paper and being asked for my first and second choices of instruments to learn; my first choice was the cello and second was baritone… obviously they didn’t give me a cello! For the best, too, since in the sixth grade we moved to a country town where the school didn’t have an orchestra. I learned trombone because the baritone looked really dorky in jazz band….

[BrassSection]

I was in 5th grade in 64, and already knew I wanted to play baritone, as that is what Dad played in the Army. No resistance with my choice, and I was the only one in my lessons classes that year and the next before moving into Jr high band. Trumpet and trombone now get most play time, but euph is still my favorite to play.

My son wanted to follow in his Dad's and granddad's footsteps with baritone, but no school horn was available so he started on trumpet. Switched to baritone (treble clef) the next year when one was available and stuck with that until he was out of high school. He hasn’t played since.

Starting in 5th grade for my grandson he knew he wanted to play something brass. Played all my brass instruments except for French horn for him, my daughter is the highly trained horn player so I let her play that so as not to sour him with my playing. He chose trumpet and never looked back…other than playing an occasional euphonium when needed for an ensemble.

[harrisonreed]

I saw my uncle playing the trombone in a kind of tower of power type band "Brass Attack" in MA, and thought that was what I'd like to play, before I knew what a school band was. I think I was 9. I just picked the trombone and my parents rented me a Conn director. It's crazy that they make kids choose from instruments they don't want to play.

[timothy42b]

There's no way to play a flutophone delicately. I wonder how our teachers survived.

My younger child did soprano recorder in elementary school.

The children were asked to bring in $2 to defray cost of the instruments; none of the others could. It was that kind of school. I bought the inexpensive but decent entry level Yamaha recorders for the whole class.

Alas, the music teacher knew only German (non-forked) fingering, and I had purchased the standard Baroque. My child actually practiced and I had to listen to that out of tune note over and over. "um, if you put this finger down it might sound better" ... "NO! Teacher says!"

I don't know if it bothered the teacher, I wasn't going to embarass her by asking. It drove me nuts.

[Posaunus]

Two stories: Mine and my wife’s.

1. My mother was a music-lover and a somewhat accomplished amateur pianist, so I had an appreciation for music. I took piano lessons through about 4th grade, but dropped because I didn’t like the teacher. (Big mistake!) Then I wanted to play the trumpet, but that didn’t work out in elementary school. In 7th grade, I found that several friends had enrolled in “beginning band” and enjoyed it. At the beginning of the second semester I approached the (wonderful) band director and asked to be let into the band. He explained that I was too late – should have signed up at the beginning of the school year. I begged him and promised that I would practice hard and catch up. He realized that I was serious, and let me blow a trumpet – on which I was able to make a pretty good noise. Then he handed me a trombone, and said that I sounded much better, and that he would let me in to the band if I would play the trombone and was serious about practicing. As it turned out, I loved the trombone, and talked my parents into letting me take trombone lessons. (I think my excellent teacher charged $4/hour – which he had to share with the music store – in the 1950s.) By the beginning of 8th grade I had worked my way up to 1st chair. And I never looked back.

2. My wife floundered in elementary school carrying around a violin (and never became attached, so dropped it). In 7th grade, her best friend had taken up the oboe and invited my wife to join in all the fun. She approached the band director who looked at her scores on a music aptitude test called the Seashore Measures of Musical Talents – which has long been discredited – and told her that she was a predicted “musical failure” and wouldn’t let her join the band! That was the band director’s last year on the job. My wife, ever-determined, approached the new band director the next year. He handed her an oboe, suggested she take private lessons, and welcomed her to band. That was all she needed. She became a fine oboist – attended Oberlin Conservatory and received a music education degree, then followed that with a Master’s in oboe performance at New England Conservatory. She taught music in the public schools until her retirement several years ago, and still teaches private students and performs at a high level. (Not quite a “musical failure!”)

We all started somewhere!

[SGH]

I dropped football in 1975 after 9th grade season and got sent to study hall. Detested that and asked the band director (primary instrument trumpet) if I could join. He said he needed a trombone player, loaned me his Reynolds, gave me free private lessons 5 days a week because my study hall coincided with his off period. I had 5 years of piano instruction with good teachers during elementary school so the non-horn fundamentals were already there. And 7th position wasn’t a problem. Went straight into high school band the fall of 10th grade. I’m very grateful and fortunate!

My wife’s parents gave her a Vito plastic clarinet for Christmas in the 6th grade. She was changing to public school the next year. She had no clue what it was. Her mom said, “it’s what Cousin Pete plays” (Fountain, true story).

My sons got the more traditional flutophone thing in school but got to try all of our instruments at home any time that we could supervise and instruct them, and we were late parents with 20 years of accumulation back in the pawn and thrift shop glory days when one could really score bargains. They are both decent on more than one instrument. They play for their own enjoyment these days.

[bitbckt]

I chose trombone because Riker played it on TNG.

[Tromboned]

It's interesting to hear peoples stories. My Mom was a music major on clarinet and taught choir at a neighboring school district. I wanted to play trumpet but they made us put two instruments on our selection sheet in 5th grade. My second choice was percussion although I knew I would choose trumpet. After I tried the trumpet the rep asked if I had thought about trombone? I had never considered it but tried it and made a decent sound. (I honestly think they were just trying to balance out sections because the most popular were sax, trumpet and percussion) I took piano lessons starting in 3rd grade so I could read music. I actually thought trombone was easier because I only had to read one note at a time. It lead to success early on and has stuck with me for almost 40 years. I am far from a professional but have a very busy schedule playing in community groups. I think from time to time what would have happened if I got lost in the masses of the trumpet or percussion sections early on.

[ghmerrill]

After I tried the trumpet the rep asked if I had thought about trombone? I had never considered it but tried it and made a decent sound. (I honestly think they were just trying to balance out sections because the most popular were sax, trumpet and percussion)

My recollection is that virtually ALL the boys wanted to play trumpet. And virtually all the girls wanted to play clarinet or flute. I think (hope) that has changed a lot over time. But I'm sitting here looking at the picture of my high school band when I graduated (1965), and among the 55 members are two female trumpet players and three female French horn players. The other females are all oboe/clarinet (including bass and alto)/flute players.

Tucked in at the end of the first row is our music director, a very young Robert T. Le Blanc -- fresh out of Eastman, and before he went on to a very distinguished career. https://music.osu.edu/news/robert-lebla ... essor-tuba. How we ended up with him as our high school band director for those three years was something of a miracle -- but a huge influence on my life in instrumental music -- even though I was playing saxophone at the time and he was tuba player. But it was his inspiration that caused me to take up tuba in my 40s.

[Wilktone]

How much can really be learned from looking at an 11 year-old's lips? I'm guessing not much.

You're correct, you can't tell really anything about looking at anyone's lips and determine an aptitude for a musical instrument. My dissertation research was more specific, I looked at anatomical features and tried for find a correlation to the musician's embouchure type. The results were inconclusive, indicating that you can't tell a brass musician's embouchure type by eyeballing their mouth either.

There are many common myths about brass embouchures. One myth is that player's with thin lips (meaning lip vermillion) will do better on high brass and thicker vermillion players do better on low brass. That's also a meaningless feature.

Rather than look at what anatomy a student has it's always better to help them find an instrument they will be excited to play and then help them learn to play it working with, rather than against, their natural tendencies.

Dave

[ghmerrill]

How much can really be learned from looking at an 11 year-old's lips? I'm guessing not much.

The results were inconclusive, indicating that you can't tell a brass musician's embouchure type by eyeballing their mouth either.

But then your results weren't really inconclusive -- the conclusion just didn't support what had become some common beliefs and speculations. That's how science is supposed to work.

You know, before Galileo came along people believed that heavy objects fell faster than light objects because ... err ... they were heavier. In my personal experience (university teaching) many students still believe this when entering college, and some retain the belief even after leaving it. Luckily, they never end up in situations where it matters.

[BGuttman]

I had an experience in High School that convinced me that the "thin lips high brass - thick lips low brass" thing was pure horse-hockey. We had a guy with huge lips (the stereotypical Black mouth) who was a heck of a trumpet player.

You can learn to play anything with the appropriate embouchure. I found that my teeth structure made playing a single reed instrument uncomfortable, so I was glad I was steered away from clarinet and sax.

[BrassSection]

It was noted “My recollection is that virtually ALL the boys wanted to play trumpet. And virtually all the girls wanted to play clarinet or flute.”

Not all boys wanted to play trumpet, a whole lot in my school wanted to play the drums. Are drums actually a musical instrument…

[ghmerrill]

Are drums actually a musical instrument…

No. Like bagpipes, they are properly classified as weapons.

[Kbiggs]

5th grade. The band teacher, Mr. Smart, gathered all the kids who were interested in band into the band room. (Actually, it was a double-wide trailer called a “portable,” an all-too-common solution of sorts to crowded schools and insufficiently funded school districts. I have often wondered why a district would build a new school that did not include a suitable music room in the plans.) Mr. Smart had us sing a few notes, then handed out permission slips, and instructed us to talk with our parents.

Talked it over with mom and dad. I wanted to play trumpet. My oldest brother wasn’t playing his anymore, so I thought I would use his. Trombone was listed as a distant second.

Next week, I turned in the permission slip to Mr. Smart. He looks at me, looks at the paper, and says, “You look like a big strapping young lad. How’s about the trombone?” It was true. At the time: I was taller than many of my classmates. From such humble beginnings…

[robcat2075]

In our elementary system, there was a concert for all the 5th graders where the different instruments were demonstrated by some seventh graders.

I had previously thought I wanted to play the trumpet but I didn't like the sound of it at this presentation. Trombone and drums were the only other "boy" instruments of the basic options, so... trombone.

We were also given a "music aptitude" test but the only practical application of that was to limit the number of kids allowed to choose drums. I asked if I had done well enough to choose drums if I wanted to and the teacher said I had. But I had no real interest in drums.

At the beginning of the summer there was a day to go to the school and see the various merchants display their wares. My mom and I chose the least expensive new trombone, the Conn 14H. My father was appalled at the cost even though it was not at all a hardship at his earning level.

And thus began many years of mediocre trombone playing!

[BGuttman]

One common issue with percussion is that many kids just want to bang something and they really aren't interested in music per se. One teacher here in New Hampshire used to insist that the percussion kids had to take bells with the drums so they had to learn melody. I liked that. It weeded out the "head bangers" and got at the ones who really wanted to make music with the "bang gang".

[TomWest]

In the 5th grade I had a crush on a girl. On beginning band day I picked clarinet so I could sit next to her.

[robcat2075]

If I could go back in time and change one thing, it would be that I could learn the cello instead of the trombone. That would change many things.

However, there was no string program in my school system, it was never a thought.