Hey guys, I just got a new student who is switching from sax to trombone at the behest of his band director. He started maybe 4 or 5 months ago without a teacher, and then got in touch with me after hitting various road blocks.
Among the hardest problems to solve are the fact that his lower lip goes way into the mouth covering the lips (my understanding is that this is typical sax embouchure). He also tends to slide the mouthpiece very far to the right of his embouchure as he goes up in the range. Sound tends to get very thin up there it and is in general not very predictable for him. Over a couple of lessons I've managed to help him with the first habit, but still having trouble with the second one. Any ideas for how to encourage him to develop a more functional embouchure up high? Many thanks.
Student switching from Sax
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ttf_anonymous
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ttf_vegasbound
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Student switching from Sax
Tell the student to go back to the sax, learn all the doubles, clarinet flute etc etc they will get more gigs than being a trombone player!
And more importantly what does the student want to play?
And more importantly what does the student want to play?
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ttf_BGuttman
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Student switching from Sax
I don't think that's an option, Vegas. 
For the shifting, try lip slurs concentrating on keeping the mouthpiece in the same place.
For the shifting, try lip slurs concentrating on keeping the mouthpiece in the same place.
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ttf_davdud101
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Student switching from Sax
Quote from: vegasbound on Mar 01, 2017, 09:59AMTell the student to go back to the sax, learn all the doubles, clarinet flute etc etc they will get more gigs than being a trombone player!
And more importantly what does the student want to play?
Haha, +1 on these...
Not to mention Bruce's comment, as lip slurs and long tones have helped correct my embouchure and build what I think of as an 'air-efficient embouchure', time and time again, from trumpet down to tuba.
Good luck! I've currently got a student switching from flute, and her starting place is also learning to set a good embouchure for tone and range (amongst other things).
And more importantly what does the student want to play?
Haha, +1 on these...
Not to mention Bruce's comment, as lip slurs and long tones have helped correct my embouchure and build what I think of as an 'air-efficient embouchure', time and time again, from trumpet down to tuba.
Good luck! I've currently got a student switching from flute, and her starting place is also learning to set a good embouchure for tone and range (amongst other things).
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ttf_kwbryson
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Student switching from Sax
Quote from: vegasbound on Mar 01, 2017, 09:59AM
And more importantly what does the student want to play?
I think he's interested in trombone and is generally enjoying it. I don't ever have to nag him about practicing. He has a killer vintage olds that his grandfather used to play on!
And more importantly what does the student want to play?
I think he's interested in trombone and is generally enjoying it. I don't ever have to nag him about practicing. He has a killer vintage olds that his grandfather used to play on!
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ttf_svenlarsson
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Student switching from Sax
QuoteAmong the hardest problems to solve are the fact that his lower lip goes way into the mouth covering the lips (my understanding is that this is typical sax embouchure).
That is not a typically sax embouchure, more clarinette but not really. Maybe the idea to play trombone was to get away from the sax beacause of embouchure problem?
I would have him play som flute, that is actually closer to brass embouchure then what many think.
How does he sound?
Did you mean "covering the teeth"?
I have some former trombone students who do play with the lower lip going into the mouth, some are pro players and do sound very good.
It is a bit difficult to really understand what "way into the mouth" is. Can he articulate? How is his range? ASnd most important how is the sound?
That is not a typically sax embouchure, more clarinette but not really. Maybe the idea to play trombone was to get away from the sax beacause of embouchure problem?
I would have him play som flute, that is actually closer to brass embouchure then what many think.
How does he sound?
Did you mean "covering the teeth"?
I have some former trombone students who do play with the lower lip going into the mouth, some are pro players and do sound very good.
It is a bit difficult to really understand what "way into the mouth" is. Can he articulate? How is his range? ASnd most important how is the sound?
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ttf_kwbryson
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- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2018 11:59 am
Student switching from Sax
Quote from: svenlarsson on Mar 02, 2017, 02:20AM
That is not a typically sax embouchure, more clarinette but not really. Maybe the idea to play trombone was to get away from the sax beacause of embouchure problem?
I would have him play som flute, that is actually closer to brass embouchure then what many think.
How does he sound?
Did you mean "covering the teeth"?
I have some former trombone students who do play with the lower lip going into the mouth, some are pro players and do sound very good.
It is a bit difficult to really understand what "way into the mouth" is. Can he articulate? How is his range? ASnd most important how is the sound?
Right now he can play pretty well from
up to 
but it's not as consistent up there. Tone is getting better in the low range but it thins out really quickly as he gets higher. I know what you mean by playing with the lower lip in a bit, I do this myself and it works well for me, but on this student it was pretty extreme. It seems to be getting much better. Now I'm mostly focusing on the dramatic shift to the right that he does as he gets high.
That is not a typically sax embouchure, more clarinette but not really. Maybe the idea to play trombone was to get away from the sax beacause of embouchure problem?
I would have him play som flute, that is actually closer to brass embouchure then what many think.
How does he sound?
Did you mean "covering the teeth"?
I have some former trombone students who do play with the lower lip going into the mouth, some are pro players and do sound very good.
It is a bit difficult to really understand what "way into the mouth" is. Can he articulate? How is his range? ASnd most important how is the sound?
Right now he can play pretty well from
up to but it's not as consistent up there. Tone is getting better in the low range but it thins out really quickly as he gets higher. I know what you mean by playing with the lower lip in a bit, I do this myself and it works well for me, but on this student it was pretty extreme. It seems to be getting much better. Now I'm mostly focusing on the dramatic shift to the right that he does as he gets high.-
ttf_kwbryson
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Student switching from Sax
I tried the following set of exercises with him this week, with much success:
1) Long tones on and 
with a focus on setting up correctly and getting good tone.
2) Slur between those two ranges.
3) do long tones on 
4) ad that to the slurs.
5) continue pattern until you get to
1) Long tones on
and with a focus on setting up correctly and getting good tone.2) Slur between those two ranges.
3) do long tones on
4) ad that to the slurs.
5) continue pattern until you get to
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ttf_kwbryson
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2018 11:59 am
Student switching from Sax
I tried the following set of exercises with him this week, with much success:
1) Long tones on and with a focus on setting up correctly and getting good tone.
2) Slur between those two ranges.
3) do long tones on
4) ad that to the slurs.
5) continue pattern until you get to
1) Long tones on
and with a focus on setting up correctly and getting good tone.2) Slur between those two ranges.
3) do long tones on
4) ad that to the slurs.
5) continue pattern until you get to