M/K LEADPIPES

[johnnymack]

WHAT are you thoughts on the M/K Leadpipes?
I have yet to try any but I have a trial request in for some 525 pipes.
The Bach Style vs the Conn Style?
Different alloys and playing carachteristics?
How about the Bass Models and the 547 bores?
Thanks, John McKevitt

[mrdeacon]

I'm a big fan. I had one of their prototype Robert's pipes a long time ago and thought it was nothing special. I recently picked up one of their newer Roberts pipes and it's one of the best pipes I've ever played!

I haven't tried their MV50B pipe but it's supposed to be a copy of a different leadpipe then the one Brad used for his pipes, so they aren't really comparable.

[Kbiggs]

I have two GR pipes, one in yellow and one in gold brass. I prefer the yellow.

I also have the MV50 pipe in yellow which I use 98% of the time in my modified 50B. I really like it. Even response, good scale. I like it very much.

IIRC, M&W trombones are using M/K pipes in their horns.

[Jimkinkella]

Hey Philip, do you use a gr in your Minick?

[mrdeacon]

Yeah! That's the pipe I ended up with in the Minick! Something seemed to really click when I threw it in there.

I also tried it in Burgerbob's old 60H and I dug it a lot in there too.

[Jimkinkella]

Neat! Did you go yellow or nickle?

[mrdeacon]

Yellow! Though I'm very interested to try the nickel considering the price.

I feel that the MK GR pipe really tames the Minick and other TIS horns I've put it in. Maybe tames it too much for some but it works for me! Well... for right now at least... until I get the leadpipe itch again

[Schlitz]

.

[Kbiggs]

There were some discussions on the defunct forum about M/K pipes. One of the fellows at M&W chimed in at one point and said they had found that the GR pipes tend to work better on two-piece bells (Conn, Holton, Minick), while the MV50 and MV42 pipes tend to work better on one-piece bells (Bach).

[Bassbonechandler]

Dumb question but are edwards/getzen more bachish? I have a getzen 1052fd.

[Trav1s]

I am following this as I have a .522” Conn that I want to pull the original pipe and set up for interchangeable.

[Matt K]

Dumb question but are edwards/getzen more bachish? I have a getzen 1052fd.

The 1052 comes with a 1, 2, and 3 pipe. Usually Bach are somewhere between a 1 and a 2.

[Bassbonechandler]

I meant more towards what Kbiggs said about the bell. The only thing I know is that the 1052 has a unsoldered rim.

[Matt K]

I meant more towards what Kbiggs said about the bell. The only thing I know is that the 1052 has a unsoldered rim.

Unsoldered bell bead; 2 piece. Its as heavy as they make bells though (23 gauge). So not neither Bach nor Conn; usually the Conn bells are fairly light, or at least not 23 gauge.

Mine is being... erm... heavily modified as I type. But prior to that, I found a Sterling Silver Dave Taylor pipe worked the best of the pipes I had (I was missing a 3). It's very short for a Sterling pipe. I think 6" eyeballing it. I'll have to check. Whatever the taper/length combination + sterling gave me the biggest array of colors that came quickly without sacrificing too much on the stability front which makes sense since it was basically impossible to redline that thing with the "2" leadpipe I got it with.

[Bassbonechandler]

I'm using the 3 pipe with mine right now. I'm just looking to try something different down the road. I know brass ark also has a bunch of different leadpipes as well.

[Matt K]

I'm using the 3 pipe with mine right now. I'm just looking to try something different down the road. I know brass ark also has a bunch of different leadpipes as well.

Yeah the GR/Conn pipes tend to be closer to the 3 and the Bach ones are closer to the 1. If you try your 2 pipe and then 1 pipe and the 2 is an 'improvement' and the one is a little too far or, then the MV pipes might work for you; if not, I'd steer towards the GR or the Conn style pipes. But there are, of course, other considerations since it isn't just a matter of "3 has more of a taper than a 1" - the location, shape, and distance to the taper & length are fairly crucial as well.
In either case, Noah is really good at helping pick out your pipes. He's got quite the waitlist at the moment so it would be worth getting on that if you were wanting one sometime this year!

[Bassbonechandler]

I was using the 3 pipe on my old mouthpiece before moving to my 93d. At first I switched back to the 2 because at the time the 93d and 3 was too much. But I've switched back to the 3 and been in that for a bit now. I just like the amount of air I can dump into my horn with the 3 currently.

[johnnymack]

Thanks. To Travis, M/K are sending me the 525B and 525C both in Yellow and Nickel on their Trial policy.
I have had a 37 78H in Satin Silver that I used a Shires M3 pipe on. It was great. I sold that horn to fund my Williams 6 and 8 purchases. I sanded the pipe down to fit the 522 bore. I also had an Edwards 3 that I did not need to sand down to fit the 522 bore. Both were more open than the original 78H pipe and added greatly to the sound.
I picked up a 53 Conn 78H from Noah that I am having the pipe pulled . I will be trying theses pipes and my SHires 3 on it so I'll let you know how it goes.THe 50's 78H is a bit lighter ga than my old 1937. Its lighter but Super resonant FWIW I also acquired a Lawler 525 Big Boy. What a Horn!!! The Shires 3 works nice on it . Dark with alot of core to the sound . Everything slots in nicely. The bell is an 8.5"and a bit heavy. I am also hoping one of these M/K will work out on it for a more useable Commercial sound. The original is a 2 piece construction and a bit tight for me. Brasslab has/had a nice selection back in the 90's/2000 when I had a 69 78H. THe Rutherford Model was one and there was an Open and SHort 525 pipe that worked well for Commercial settings. I'd like to find that pipe again. I emailed and texted Chuck. He said he would check , and get back to me. I guess I need to check in with him again

[johnnymack]

FWIW I had a SET OF NEWER CONN 525 BORE LEADPIPES I PICKED UP FROM A FORUM MEMBER. I liked them very much. They went with the 37 Conn 78H sale though. They also fit in the 522 bore COnn with no modification.

[Kbiggs]

Sorry, my last post was misleading. MattK got it right: the fellow (M? W?) at M&W said that unsoldered beads like Conn, Minick, etc., tend to respond better on the GR pipe. TIS horns also sounded better with the GR pipe. Soldered beads like a Bach responded better with the MV50 style pipe.

Edwards and Shires can have either soldered or unsoldered beads. Just gotta look at the specs.

FWIW, in my experience with a modified 50B3, the GR pipes were good, very good. The 50 pipe is just better—for my taste.

[mrdeacon]

I wouldn't say the GR pipes are like a #3 style pipe. They have a lot of initial resistance up front but they are very open after that initial resistance. The pipe gives you something to grip on to instead of just being super crazy open.

Here's another way to word it... Brad's MV50B pipe I would describe as a more "consistently" resistant pipe, like a #1 or #1.5 style pipe. While the MK GR pipe is resistant up front like a number #1 pipe but blows overall open like a #2 or #3 pipe.

I hope that makes sense... I'm pretty tired haha

[Kbiggs]

Seeing that someone mentioned BrassArk pipes...

I used these in my horn before the M/K pipes. I really liked the response and the sound. Unfortunately, in my case, the scale of the instrument was thrown off. Octaves, esp. between and were quite “narrow,” not quite an octave. I had to make some pretty significant hand slide adjustments.

Please don’t let that deter anyone from trying Noah and Brad’s pipes. Again, the sound and response were great. I believe the scale was thrown off due a combination of several things (a shortened tuning slide, some health problems I was having at the time, and another stupid attempt at an embouchure change). I might try them again in the future, but I’m pretty happy with the M/K pipes for now.

[TheSheriff]

WHAT are you thoughts on the M/K Leadpipes?
I have yet to try any but I have a trial request in for some 525 pipes.
The Bach Style vs the Conn Style?
Different alloys and playing carachteristics?
How about the Bass Models and the 547 bores?
Thanks, John McKevitt

=====

I tried the Conn style, both yellow and red brass in a custom slide I had made for an old Williams L model. They are very nice pipes even though I decided not to purchase one. I preferred the zip I get from my King 3B+ pipe; that's the lead player in me talking. Honestly, If I were looking for a great all rounder I would strongly consider one.

I did not try the Bach style based on the fact that I have never been a fan of Bach trombones.

--------

[Inspector71]

Sorry, my last post was misleading. MattK got it right: the fellow (M? W?) at M&W said that unsoldered beads like Conn, Minick, etc., tend to respond better on the GR pipe. TIS horns also sounded better with the GR pipe. Soldered beads like a Bach responded better with the MV50 style pipe.

Edwards and Shires can have either soldered or unsoldered beads. Just gotta look at the specs.

FWIW, in my experience with a modified 50B3, the GR pipes were good, very good. The 50 pipe is just better—for my taste.

That sounds like something I might have said....but I've slept since then.

In any case, that tends to be the direction for the best pairing of pipes and bells.

[johnnymack]

Everything you need to know about M/K leadpipes. THanks for everyones opinion.
I received 4 .525 bore pipes the other day. The 525B in yellow and nickel and the 525 C in yellow and nickel.
They come in a heavy gauge which is something I like in leadpipes.
FWIW I use the Brasslab Heavy WT B90-1 and B90 -3 on my Bass Trb.
I also had a custom 578 bore made in the style of the B90-1 Hwt for my Shires 578 bore slide
The B stands for Bach like and the C for Conn like.
I seem to prefer the 525B pipes as they are more open. The 525 C are also very nice. A bit more compact sound.. I don't normally like Nickel pipes but these have a great focus and are not too bright . Maybe its the heavier gauge. My SHires 3 is still the pipe of choice though. I tried these in my Lawler BIg Boy and a 50's Era Conn 78H. I f anyone is in need of a Conn 78H 1953 522 bore leadpipe I will sell it. THanks again for everyones opinion

[Trav1s]

Thanks for the update! Also, sent you a message about the 78H pipe.

[elmsandr]

I meant more towards what Kbiggs said about the bell. The only thing I know is that the 1052 has a unsoldered rim.

Unsoldered bell bead; 2 piece. Its as heavy as they make bells though (23 gauge). So not neither Bach nor Conn; usually the Conn bells are fairly light, or at least not 23 gauge.

Mine is being... erm... heavily modified as I type. But prior to that, I found a Sterling Silver Dave Taylor pipe worked the best of the pipes I had (I was missing a 3). It's very short for a Sterling pipe. I think 6" eyeballing it. I'll have to check. Whatever the taper/length combination + sterling gave me the biggest array of colors that came quickly without sacrificing too much on the stability front which makes sense since it was basically impossible to redline that thing with the "2" leadpipe I got it with.

Just a note about gauge sizing.. getzen and Edwards make bells from 20-23 gauge. 23 is the lightest gauge.

I have no memory of where the 1052/1062 bells are on the spectrum, just wanted to fix the nomenclature error.

Cheers,
Andy

[Matt K]

Yeesh yeah that's correct. The official documentation says is "dual gauge" but 23. One of those moments where the horn plays so differently than the I'd expect I didn't even notice the number. It does seem like a heavier horn to me but Andy is right, specwise, it's actually fairly close to Conn bells. Now I'm curious...

[BrianJohnston]

Bringing this forum back to life, since I have experience with M/K lead pipes.

M/K Lead pipes are fantastic, but I get a higher quality tone from Brad Close's MV42 pipes for some reason. Regardless, I recommend both.

[modelerdc]

The only M/K leadpipe I've tried is the one that's modeled after the Bach bass bone pipe. It's more open than most stock 50B pipes, but still very playable. I like it on the Bach bass trombone, though on a Shires I still prefer the stock #2. If you play a Bach Bass, it's worth checking out.

[heldenbone]

M/K GR pipe in sterling silver made a big difference in my Getzen 1062-FDR - red brass bell, 22-gauge, dual bore .562-.578 slide. It tightened up the response, making it brighter and more immediate. Tuning is very good across octaves, low range is easy and snappy, and trigger range is noticeably easier than with the stock Getzen pipes. Handling it requires a bit of care, as the inserted end is very thin and easily deformed.