.500 Leadpipes

[TromboneMonkey]

I'm soliciting opinions and comparisons on .500 leadpipes! Brassark, Shires, Kanstul, Lawler, Edwards, Marcinkiewicz, Conn, Brasslab, others?

I have read all of the other threads I can find on the topic-- there are some interesting ones, to be sure, but I'd like to get a more comprehensive and specific sample of players' thoughts.

Which have you played, and how do they compare to one another? Are there specific horns in which each work well? Material differences? Please share your thoughts.

I'd be particularly interested in hearing from anyone who has given a thorough blow through all/most of Kanstul's pipes (as there are many)-- or someone who has compared them to Shires'.

I find that comparisons of this type are only useful in the specific bore size-- comparing .547 brands to one another will not do!

[Matt K]

For the Shires/Edwads/Rath pipes the same descriptions generally apply to all the sizes. Namely that the "1" are the most clear articulations at the expense of a certain breadth of sound and the "3" pipes are the inverse with the "2" being somewhere in the middle. Shires also offers intermediate sizes such as 1.5 and 2.5. I've tried neither the Rath nor the Edwards to the same degree that I have the Shires pipes. I've found that those description hold up well for all the bore sizes as I've owned horns that have had Shires pipes for every size they offer with the exception of the 495 and 578 pipes.

I've tried the Kanstul H8 and... I believe the W6 the former on my Shires 508 and the latter on a King 3B that I had the upper swapped for a 2B+ (so it was 500/508). I found in both cases they were closer to the "3" side of the spectrum and ultimately opted for other pipes that wee a little less broad. (A 2.5N in the Shires - which I'm incidentally selling, and a stock 2b+ pipe in the King).

I've also A/B compared a 32H with a YSL356 slide which are really similar on paper... and as far as I can tell are fairly similar dimensionaly as well. My findings parallel what Noah indicates the 32H replica pipe so I think between those two observations I can affirm that the 32H pipe is closer to the "1" side of things. I actually have a sterling silver one on order from Noah. I dig sterling pipes on larger horns so we'll see if I do so on these small ones. I really like the way the 32H makes the 356G play... as Noah says:

This is a classic pipe that is great for trombonists looking to slot up their unfocused instrument. It removes the sloppiness of slow responding trombones and give a well defined clarity and feedback to each partial giving much more consistency.

When I tried a 32H slide on the 356 (which has a 32H pipe in it obviously) that's exactly what I experienced. My thought is that with sterling, it might make it a little more 'dense' sounding (not closer to a '3' though - sterling is a really hard material to describe) and even a little bit of the extra focus. "Goldilocks"!

[imsevimse]

I like Noahs pipes. I use his Conn 32H copper lead pipe with my Kanstul 1606 - the .500 Williams 6 copy. The horn becomes more distinct. It becomes more of a lead horn than with any of the original pipes. I also use a special ordered Conn 32H pipe made to fit my .508 Xeno Yamaha 891Z. The same improvement happen to thay horn.

/Tom

[TromboneMonkey]

Is your 2.5N unthreaded? If so I might buy it.

[TheSheriff]

I'm soliciting opinions and comparisons on .500 leadpipes! Brassark, Shires, Kanstul, Lawler, Edwards, Marcinkiewicz, Conn, Brasslab, others?

I have read all of the other threads I can find on the topic-- there are some interesting ones, to be sure, but I'd like to get a more comprehensive and specific sample of players' thoughts.

Which have you played, and how do they compare to one another? Are there specific horns in which each work well? Material differences? Please share your thoughts.

I'd be particularly interested in hearing from anyone who has given a thorough blow through all/most of Kanstul's pipes (as there are many)-- or someone who has compared them to Shires'.

I find that comparisons of this type are only useful in the specific bore size-- comparing .547 brands to one another will not do!

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It's a can of worms. Get your hands on as many different ones as you are able, and have at it. It will surprise you. There are so many factors. It will change from day to day. Be smart about it. One mouthpiece, one horn, and one leadpipe per day. Too many changes in the course of a single day and you're screwed. You'll never be able to find where one is, ya dig? Even after you think you've nailed it, you probably haven't. So.....spend more time sussin' it out. Again, ya dig?

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[TheSheriff]

I'd be particularly interested in hearing from anyone who has given a thorough blow through all/most of Kanstul's pipes (as there are many)-- or someone who has compared them to Shires'.

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I've played all of the Kanstul pipes. The W6 is my favorite in my Lawler trombones along with a custom Hammond piece that is in the Stork T2 territory, but a wee bit deeper.

The H6 is my favorite in my Kanstul 1606 with a different custom Hammond that is a tad shallower than the one I use in my Lawler's.

I used to use the Kanstul S pipe in my 1606 but eventually found it to be too tight. I once tried the H8 version for .500 bore horns and found it to be like blowing into a trash can; unfocused, etcetera. I just may order another one to try in my Lawler. I also tried a H16; not for me. I have a Bach 12 pipe too, but again; not for me. I tried the Kanstul Kaplan, Jiggs, and 2B+ pipes and.....nope.

So as you can see, it is about balance and what you are looking for in sound and feel, and....? The balance of how you blow, the horn, mouthpiece, pipe, blah blah blah. Have I been playing a lot and my chops are trashed? Have I not been playing enough and my chops are weak? More blah blah blah.

I LOVE Lawler trombones but I am not a fan of his leadpipes. They do not work for ME. I find them too tight and I can't get enough volume out of them. But then again, I am a very strong player. Work horse type.

I've never tried a Shires pipe. His stuff does not interest me. I find his small bore tenors to be boring in the sound department.

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[TromboneMonkey]

It's a can of worms. Get your hands on as many different ones as you are able, and have at it. It will surprise you. There are so many factors. It will change from day to day. Be smart about it. One mouthpiece, one horn, and one leadpipe per day. Too many changes in the course of a single day and you're screwed. You'll never be able to find where one is, ya dig? Even after you think you've nailed it, you probably haven't. So.....spend more time sussin' it out. Again, ya dig?

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I dig! It's amazing the changes that take place when one "settles" into a combo a bit. I recently grabbed an AR Kaplan piece from Luke and after about 36 hours BWAM I love everything about it. When I was A vs. Bing it with other pieces I couldn't make heads or tails of them. Thanks for the (good) advice!

By the way I'm about to snag a 2R from Roy when I roll enough pennies-- hence this post.

[Matt K]

Is your 2.5N unthreaded? If so I might buy it.

Threaded, though they could be filed down. (I actually like that arrangement quite a bit because it's still much more secure than a pressfit but also harder to get stuck). But it currently would have to come with the Shires unless someone wanted the Shires without a leadpipe

[TheSheriff]

I dig! It's amazing the changes that take place when one "settles" into a combo a bit. I recently grabbed an AR Kaplan piece from Luke and after about 36 hours BWAM I love everything about it. When I was A vs. Bing it with other pieces I couldn't make heads or tails of them. Thanks for the (good) advice!

By the way I'm about to snag a 2R from Roy when I roll enough pennies-- hence this post.

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Alrighty, then! Onward, my man! Also consider a Lawler 3R. it's open with a lot of core and immediacy of sound. Wow!

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