TromboneChat

If you're familiar with forum moderator Doug Elliott's usual descriptions for brass embouchure types you might find the embouchure of trumpet player Sergei Nakariakov's embouchure to be quite unusual. Take a look and see if you can spot what's so uncommon.



His playing is wonderful! But there's something that is quite strange to see, if you've looked at embouchures closely enough to spot it. Can you see it?

Dave

Two things I noticed:

1. He has two (maybe more) different placements: one pretty balanced and one extraordinarily low. Also, he seems to wander from side to side.

2. I watched a classic Pivot where his trumpet angle changes as he changes his range.

I'm sure I missed the important part if there is one.

But I also agree that's some formidable playing. Odd placement or no.

Looks to me like his occlusion involves moving a bit down and to his left when descending. Not very unusual.

I'm thinking it's a bit of an unusually low placement for that occlusion, though, which in my very limited experience usually happens on a higher-placed downstream setup.

Exactly. In 'old school' Reinhardt terms, he looks like a IV in terms of placement, with a IIIA pivot.

I'd be interested to see what it looks like in a transparent mouthpiece. It might be more IIIA like 'under the hood'

I think it's only on the outside that it looks like low placement. I've seen that before but maybe not as much - Inside the mouthpiece I'd bet his top lip reaches down to a position closer to a standard IIIA placement.

On this one with a better front view his placement is distinctly higher. And his sound is a little more solid. He's older and his chops have stabilized to a better place.

I know a trumpet player in Vancouver (BC) that has a similar look, looks like a pretty low placement, but pretty clear IIIA pivot. Great player as well.

Thanks for posting. I've listened to his playing since he was a child - well I guess he's not that old now. Googles. Wow, he's 41 now, but there are some very young videos out there. But he seems a classic example of the child prodigy.

Exactly. In 'old school' Reinhardt terms, he looks like a IV in terms of placement, with a IIIA pivot.

I'd be interested to see what it looks like in a transparent mouthpiece. It might be more IIIA like 'under the hood'

That is what I noticed. I also wonder how it would look inside. My suspicion is that it would still be downstream, even though from the outside it looks like it could be upstream. I've not come across any "very high placement" type players (Reinhardt IIIA) that have such a low placement before.

On this one with a better front view his placement is distinctly higher. And his sound is a little more solid. He's older and his chops have stabilized to a better place.

Thanks for finding and posting that video. His placement does look much more like a typical "very high placement" type in that one. In Reinhardt's "Encyclopedia" he does note that (apparent) upstream players who push up to ascend may want to move their placement up higher on the lips.

Dave

In a similar discussion on trumpet herald, some of the posters mentioned that while his playing is superb, he does not venture into the high range much. Maybe his apparent low placement is partly because of emphasis in middle and low range?

Right

I read this in Charles Stacy trombone studies,is this normal? Sorry I pasted it from pdf.”The extremely high registers must be acquired with as light pressure of the mouthpiece upon the lips, reliance being placed entirely upon the lip muscles for the contraction of the embouchure.” There is a school of thought advocating tongue use, what do members here recommend?

"As little pressure as possible"
and
"Contraction of the embouchure"
are two ideas that will usually lead to big trouble.

I bought Wynton Marsalis' album of cornet solos back in the 90s and thought he was quite skillful but this Nakariakov guy makes Marsalis sound sloppy.

Whatever he's doing, it doesn't seem to have impeded him.

robcat2075 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 10, 2018 12:54 pm I bought Wynton Marsalis' album of cornet solos back in the 90s and thought he was quite skillful but this Nakariakov guy makes Marsalis sound sloppy.

Whatever he's doing, it doesn't seem to have impeded him.

Or, he's chosen to focus on mid range excellence, and accepts whatever limitations that may entail.

His fluegelhorn work is amazing.

Just because... here's an apples-to-apples comparison with both playing Paganini's "Moto Perpetuo"

You only need to listen to about the first minute of each to get a sense of it.








I have no idea if "editing" has any role in either of these recordings. There are lots of Youtube videos of people doing "Moto Perpetuo" on various instruments but none doing it live on a trumpet.

I probably have more confidence that Marsalis's is not edited since the labor of the circular breathing is so obvious. i can only catch one brief drop out in Nakariakov's version.

But I have no idea about either, really.

While there may not be a live version of Moto Perpetuo, here is a live version of Nakariakov playing Ad Absurdum. There are better camera versions, but we get a better look at his embouchure here.

Tonguing while circular breathing is always impressive...

Crazy.. any trombonists on that level with circular breathing ?

bgreen wrote: ↑Tue Sep 11, 2018 2:15 pm While there may not be a live version of Moto Perpetuo, here is a live version of Nakariakov playing Ad Absurdum.

That is indeed impressive. That has to be the undetectable circular breathing ever done. He must have most open sinuses in the world. I can't inhale that fast even through my mouth.

Lousy piece of music but it looks like the composer acknowledged that in the title.