Modifying a 882GO

[NordicTrombone]

I recently got my hands on a used Yamaha 882GO in great shape for an even greater price. This leaves me with some cash and I wonder if I could change the horn to improve it some.

Has anyone ever tried to change the slide crook from yellow brass to nickel? How did I turn out? I also consider removing the braces connecting the F-attachment slide to the bell section and get some sort of edge bracing instead in hopes of opening up the sound a bit. Has anyone done something like that to a Xeno or other horns and what are your experiences. Of course I'm thinking of pulling the leap pipe, the Xeno pipe feels very tight.

What are your thoughts, have you had similar mods done to your horns? Anything you might have to add will be appreciated

[norbie2018]

I recently got my hands on a used Yamaha 882GO in great shape for an even greater price. This leaves me with some cash and I wonder if I could change the horn to improve it some.

Has anyone ever tried to change the slide crook from yellow brass to nickel? How did I turn out? I also consider removing the braces connecting the F-attachment slide to the bell section and get some sort of edge bracing instead in hopes of opening up the sound a bit. Has anyone done something like that to a Xeno or other horns and what are your experiences. Of course I'm thinking of pulling the leap pipe, the Xeno pipe feels very tight.

What are your thoughts, have you had similar mods done to your horns? Anything you might have to add will be appreciated

I added edge-style bracing to the f attachment and added a Conn width nickel crook to the slide. I figured out that I do better with wide slides; I replaced the end crook with a wide nickel silver bass end crook from MK drawing. They advertise theirs is a bit smaller in diameter compared to a Bach end crook.

Results? I feel the bell is more resonant and the slide freer blowing with the mods. I also purchased a Yamaha wide lightweight nickel slide with bass end crook and used that for a while. They're both great slides, but I prefer the yellow slide better (the nickel silver will come up for sale soon if you're interested). I think for the money invested and results I would do it again, minus the first Conn nickel crook.

[Matt K]

I know someone who replaced the receiver on the bell and added a Shires slide to it. The result was really amazing. That slide has an oddly tight crook and leadpipe with wide-open slots. Very unique blow.

Crook & Leadpipe swap are definitely the direction I'd go, although probably leadpipe first. I actually have the 882G0 slide from the horn I mentioned. I swapped out the upper for a 645 slide inner/outer (525 bore). With the original crook but different leadpipe, it's a totally different slide. Of course, it's half different so take that with a grain of salt but it's currently my primary slide. Conn "X" leadpipe for classical stuff and Conn 52H pipe for anything else. I initially tried to just pull the pipe and had a '2' in it and it was a substantial improvement for me.

Long story short, yeah I'd swap that leadpipe and see how far that takes you.

[paulyg]

Every Yamaha I've tried has played better with a different leadpipe (not stock). Same thing for my Schilke-Greenhoe, FWIW.

[castrubone]

I recently got my hands on a used Yamaha 882GO in great shape for an even greater price. This leaves me with some cash and I wonder if I could change the horn to improve it some.

Has anyone ever tried to change the slide crook from yellow brass to nickel? How did I turn out? I also consider removing the braces connecting the F-attachment slide to the bell section and get some sort of edge bracing instead in hopes of opening up the sound a bit. Has anyone done something like that to a Xeno or other horns and what are your experiences. Of course I'm thinking of pulling the leap pipe, the Xeno pipe feels very tight.

What are your thoughts, have you had similar mods done to your horns? Anything you might have to add will be appreciated

What are you trying to accomplish with all of those modifications? Changing the ledapipe, moving the bracing, changing the slide crook, etc. RADICALLY alters the instrument in unpredictable ways. You mentioned "opening up" the sound. I'd suggest just trying different mouthpieces before you do major surgery on the horn. Custom tinkering on horns can be very timely and costly and if it doesn't work out then you're stuck with it.

Mouthpieces can alter the blow/feel of a horn dramatically and are way cheaper to toy around with. I'd try every mouthpiece you can get your hands on and if it's still not feeling right, then tool around with the counterweight (they're adjustable).

[norbie2018]

What are you trying to accomplish with all of those modifications? Changing the ledapipe, moving the bracing, changing the slide crook, etc. RADICALLY alters the instrument in unpredictable ways. You mentioned "opening up" the sound. I'd suggest just trying different mouthpieces before you do major surgery on the horn. Custom tinkering on horns can be very timely and costly and if it doesn't work out then you're stuck with it.

Nothing he proposes would radically alter the instrument nor would the results of said modifications be unpredictable. Alerting a couple of braces and changing the slide crook out hardly qualify as major surgery, IMO. If he's got the coin and wants to tinker and knows the possible risks vs rewards why not? Yes, I would agree one should have a goal in mind before surgery, but OP stated what he's looking for in his original post.

[Matt K]

I would normally agree, but particularly in the case of the 882G0, it's pretty niche. The accompanying mouthpiece (the Peter Sullivan) is quite similar to an older stock 6.5AL, with the super tight, basically small shank backbore that fits in a large shank receiver. It's worth it in this case to get something that plays a little easier with a more 'conventional' setup in my estimation.

I do agree on the other points though. The valve section is actually remarkably well engineered. The rotary port actually extends almost down to the slide receiver so there is basically no gap between the slide and the valve. Makes it really hard to get right if you want a new receiver on it but... yeah in short, the valve is not the part of the equation that causes anyone Iv'e known who had that model to have issues. It's almost exclusively the leadpipe.

[castrubone]

What are you trying to accomplish with all of those modifications? Changing the ledapipe, moving the bracing, changing the slide crook, etc. RADICALLY alters the instrument in unpredictable ways. You mentioned "opening up" the sound. I'd suggest just trying different mouthpieces before you do major surgery on the horn. Custom tinkering on horns can be very timely and costly and if it doesn't work out then you're stuck with it.

Nothing he proposes would radically alter the instrument nor would the results of said modifications be unpredictable. Alerting a couple of braces and changing the slide crook out hardly qualify as major surgery, IMO. If he's got the coin and wants to tinker and knows the possible risks vs rewards why not? Yes, I would agree one should have a goal in mind before surgery, but OP stated what he's looking for in his original post.

I hear what you're saying, but those are major changes in my book. Very slight changes have sometimes huge effects on the sound/feel of the instrument. For example, Charlie Vernon used to take the rubber bumper off the end of slide to improve the feel...and thats just a little thing of rubber! You could theoretically say "Putting on a nickel crook should improve articulation" (not saying it would, but just for sake of argument), but an instrument is the sum of it's parts and every part on that horn was thought out and tested by pros to complement one another. Changing one component might improve one aspect of the horn but could negatively change another aspect. The end result is thus an unknown.

All that being said, if you enjoy tinkering and just enjoy experimenting than have fun with it! But I think it's important to remember that most non-modular stock horns are designed carefully to be balanced instruments and messing with that careful balance might result in a positive or a negative...either way you don't know for sure until the work is done.

[LIBrassCo]

Just to be clear, a crook, bracing, and a leadpipe is nowhere near major horn work. Thats all very easy stuff.

[castrubone]

Just to be clear, a crook, bracing, and a leadpipe is nowhere near major horn work. Thats all very easy stuff.

Major work as in a major change to the instrument...not how difficult the work is to perform

[LIBrassCo]

Meh, not a major change to the instrument either. Marginal at best. Whether that margin moves it from a good horn to a great horn is up the the player. Also, i saw it mentioned it's impossible to know how this will change the way a horn plays. That's also untrue.

[NordicTrombone]

It's nice to hear that some of you have done similar mods to your horns! I also understand that some of you might think it would be a wast of a already good horn. And it might be, only one way to know But I bought this Xeno as a spare horn, I already have a Conn 88HCL that I use every day as my main horn, so if the changes makes this horn worse it's not the end of the world.

But given that most of you have positive experiences I will now go ahead and see if I can get ahold of some parts

[mrdeacon]

Replace the leadpipe first and see what happens. Most techs don't charge much. $60-$80 usually (at least techs around here). Easy to do and depending on how stuck it is in there... can be pretty quick.

While it isn't major surgery to replace the crook on a slide it does require the whole slide to be taken apart and put back together which isn't exactly cheap...

For generalizations... the yellow crook will be more "Bachish" in response and blow, the nickel crook will... well play like a nickel crook haha.

[Matt K]

For generalizations... the yellow crook will be more "Bachish" in response and blow, the nickel crook will... well play like a nickel crook haha.

That really depends on what Bach-ish means. Remember, Bach has all nickel slides on the 36 and the 42, including the crook. A 42 or 36 with an all nickel slide plays quite differently than a 42 or 36 with an all yellow slide. I like the way Ben Griffin put it before he left Shires: The yellow tends to favor articulations over a halo of sound (or breadth of sound) and the nickel vice-versa.

[Samdance]

I have an YSL-882O20TH anniversary model that came from the factory with a red brass tuning slide and a nickel crook, it is a very different beast than the standard 882GO. It is definitely closer to my Bach 42 than a standard 882GO, a very broad, warm sound is easily manipulated. It does not have the "nastiness" some Bach's can have at high volumes, and also tends to be easier to play than my 42, but not quite as easy as a standard 882GO. It has a much more open blow than a standard 882.

I will say it works very well with the Pete Sullivan mouthpiece that comes with it. I use a DE 103 XT/G8 with much success.

MB

[ParLawGod]

I had an 882GOR and put a MV 42 seamed leadpipe from Brass Ark in it. WOW! Really made a great horn even better. Recommend trying some pipes from there.

[NordicTrombone]

I had an 882GOR and put a MV 42 seamed leadpipe from Brass Ark in it. WOW! Really made a great horn even better. Recommend trying some pipes from there.

Sounds like getting the leadpipe out should be the first thing to try. Is it easy adding a threaded receiver or do you need to swap out the entire cork barrel?

[Matt K]

I had an 882GOR and put a MV 42 seamed leadpipe from Brass Ark in it. WOW! Really made a great horn even better. Recommend trying some pipes from there.

Sounds like getting the leadpipe out should be the first thing to try. Is it easy adding a threaded receiver or do you need to swap out the entire cork barrel?

You can add a cork barrel right to the top but it isn't the easiest job either. I had one added to my 8820 cork barrel; I ordered the part from Shires and then Dillon Music put it on for me. I believe the total cost was ~$200. It also lengthens the instrument by .25". So if you were already pushing all the way in, possibly not the best choice. Replacing the whole upper cork barrel will also work but it's going to be a little more costly and involved as the braces are different diameters. If you do go that route, try to order the cork barrel w/o the brace receiver brazed to it. Also don't forget that Shires has 2 part cork barrels (technically 3 if you count the slide lock). So you'll have to order all three to have a fully functional barrel.

The cheapest option is unthreaded and there is enough space that you can use threaded leadpipes with the threads filed off so they are secure, but still removable.

[NordicTrombone]

Sounds like getting the leadpipe out should be the first thing to try. Is it easy adding a threaded receiver or do you need to swap out the entire cork barrel?

You can add a cork barrel right to the top but it isn't the easiest job either. I had one added to my 8820 cork barrel; I ordered the part from Shires and then Dillon Music put it on for me. I believe the total cost was ~$200. It also lengthens the instrument by .25". So if you were already pushing all the way in, possibly not the best choice. Replacing the whole upper cork barrel will also work but it's going to be a little more costly and involved as the braces are different diameters. If you do go that route, try to order the cork barrel w/o the brace receiver brazed to it. Also don't forget that Shires has 2 part cork barrels (technically 3 if you count the slide lock). So you'll have to order all three to have a fully functional barrel.

The cheapest option is unthreaded and there is enough space that you can use threaded leadpipes with the threads filed off so they are secure, but still removable.

I guess I'll be just happy without the threaded receiver for now. It can probably be added later if a want to?

[Matt K]

Yeah, the pulling of the leadpipe is the pre-requisite to those steps and if you later decide it will cost basically the same for the totality of the project. And if you like it the way it is there isn't much of a reason to add it. Actually, my favorite setup was a Conn 36H with a Shires leadpipe. I had my tech file off the threads low enough that it fit snugly in the receiver. Made it easy to remove but was more secure than threads even.

[davebb]

In this video from Richard Begel, he explains and demonstrates why he prefers to play a 882O bell section with a slide from an 882OR (and doesn't even touch a gas torch).